Subject: Help! Busted with syringe in Downtown LA Date: 29 Jul 1997 00:00:00 GMT From: Armand Newsgroups: alt.drugs.hard,misc.legal,talk.politics.drugs I am a part-time Heroin User. I do not want to get HIV nor Hepatitis, nor any other infection. I know the best way to avoid these diseases is to stop using heroin, and I am working on it. The next best way is to use clean syringes. I get my syringes at the needle exchange in Hollywood. I don't recall the EXACT name of the group running the exchange, but they are a storefront location, on Cahuenga, I think. Well, I got stopped walking down the street in Downtown LA while carrying my kit, complete with spoon, cotton, and a hype (brand new, still sealed). I had no dope on me, thank god. The police had seen me talking with a known dealer. The dealer had seen the cops first, and so he didn't sell me anything. I didn't see them until they pulled alongside and indicated I should stop. They asked me what I was doing, and I told them I was on my way to Jack in the Box (which was right ahead on the corner). They asked me if I lived in the neighborhood, and I told them I didn't. They then asked me if I worked in the neighborhood, and I told them again that I didn't. They asked me if I really was going to Jack in the Box. They asked what I was really doing. I didn't want to be caught in a lie, and I knew by this point that they had seen me talking to the dealer, so I told them the truth, that I had been intending to buy Heroin but that I hadn't bought any. They asked if they could search me, and I agreed. I didn't want to be uncooperative, and I didn't think I had really done anything wrong at this point, so I agreed. They asked me if I had any needles or weapons, and I told them that I did have a syringe, and pulled out my little case and handed it to them. I firmly believe that police do not like finding needles by accident, so I wanted to make sure that they were not surprised by anything. They handcuffed and mirandized me. I waived my rights to remain silent and to have an attorney present. I still believed that because I was a client of a Needle Exchange program, that they would just confiscate the needle and not charge me with anything, as long as I remained cooperative. They took me to their mobile command station, where they processed me. This involved an interview, where they asked about the history of my drug use. I told them that I had first used about two and a half years ago, and that I had been clean for a year and a half, until about a month and a half ago, when I had started using heroin again, but very occasionally. They then asked about the dealer I had talked to. They asked whether I had bought from him before (I said I didn't recognize him. I just walk up that one block and there is always someone selling, and that it is usually a different person every time.). They asked what the dealer had said when he wouldn't sell to me (I didn't understand what the guy was saying, but I got the point that he wasn't going to sell me anything because he waved his hand horizontally). They asked where the dealers keep the dope, and I told them that I was sure that they already knew that the dealers keep the dope in their mouths. They had me write a statement, in which I stated: "I was walking up Bonnie Brae when I was approached by two officers. They asked me if they could search me. I responded 'Yes'. They asked me if I had any weapons or needles on me. I responded 'Yes', as I had a syringe. The officers then informed me that I was under arrest." An officer told me that he was new to this field, and wanted me to tell him, for his education, how I procured, prepared, and used heroin, what the effects were, and why I used it. I gave him a basic outline of how I would buy, and more detailed instruction as to how I mixed up my dope, how much I used, how often, what it felt like, and why I used it. I never saw any of the officers involved in the interview write down any of the things that I said. This doesn't mean that they didn't, just that I never saw them. It is likely that they didn't as this was not a drug arrest, just a paraphernalia arrest, so none of my statements should have been relevant. They then took two Polaroid pictures of me. I was issued a citation with the following Description of Violation: 4143 B.P. POSS HYPODREMIC [sic] NEEDLE. (NOT A DIABETIC) I have no drug priors, other than a Drunk Driving last August, which I am still on probation for. My other priors are misdemeanor car theft 11 years ago, and a trespassing violation 10 years ago. Is there any way that I can get out of this? Can I claim that the needle was for some other use, such as chemical, veterinary, or electronic? Since I obtained the needle at the needle exchange, does that mitigate factors any? What is the severity of a needle possession charge? Is it an infraction or a misdemeanor? What sort of fine and penalty assessment can I expect? I am very poor, and am still paying installments on my Drunk Driving conviction. Should I get an attorney? I can't afford one, so I would have to rely on the public defender's office. Or should I handle this myself? What could I plea it down to? What should my next step be? My court appearance is on August 18, 1997. Any help or advice would be GREATLY appreciated. Yours Armand ==================================================================== Subject: Re: Help! Busted with syringe in Downtown LA Date: 31 Jul 1997 00:00:00 GMT From: (RML) Newsgroups: alt.drugs.hard,alt.drugs In article <19970730010440.17507.qmail@nym.alias.net>, Armand wrote: >Is there any way that I can get out of this? Can I claim that >the needle was for some other use, such as chemical, veterinary, >or electronic? Since I obtained the needle at the needle >exchange, does that mitigate factors any? I don't know how they work it in Hollywood, but in NYC, before you can obtain works at a needle exchange, they give you a quasi-ID registration card - no name is taken, just a combination of of the first letters of your last name, your mother's name, and your birthdate (no month or year). This card, to be carried whenever you're carrying their works, tells the police you've got the works from a registered needle exchange, and is supposed to indemnify you from prosecution. If you didn't get such a card in Hollywoodk, maybe they can still issue some sort of letter/statement saying you're "under their care". >Should I get an attorney? I can't afford one, so I would have to >rely on the public defender's office. Or should I handle this >myself? What could I plea it down to? When you were, as you say, "mirandized", they should have told you that "if you can't afford an attorney, one will be provided to you" or somesuchthing. In my eight H busts (all for possession), I used a private attorney about half the time. He sped things up, since he knew people in the court system, and got the record sealed on my first few convictions. But even though he was a friend, it cost me $1500+ each time. The public defenders I used the other times were less personable, even abusive on occasions - but they do this all day, every day, and know the ropes well. I got equivalent satisfactory service from them, so I wouldn't worry too much about the public defenders. Best of luck. I can't believe they make you a criminal for just carrying tools! ==================================================================== Subject: Re: Help! Busted with syringe in Downtown LA Date: 06 Aug 1997 00:00:00 GMT From: Anonymous Newsgroups: alt.drugs.hard,misc.legal,talk.politics.drugs Armand wrote: [...] I'm not an expert on this ... but it sounds to me like you handed the police a case against you on a platter. Yes, I think you should get an attorney. If I were you I would find out what the court appearance is for -- do you need to have an attorney at that time, or can you request the public defender at the court appearance. Call up the public defender's office and ask. But, here is my understanding of how to deal with police when they're questioning you: -- Never volunteer information. Don't chat with police about your drug use history or anything else. I think you can refuse to answer questions without a lawyer present. And, why are you volunteering information about the drug dealer and where they hide drugs? You're giving information about someone else who may also be victimized. Of course, your info about drug use can be used to argue that the needle is for drug use. -- Never consent to a search. If you hadn't consented to a search they might not have searched you and they wouldn't have found the needle. Don't consent to a search, even if you don't have anything incriminating on you. Things can always be planted, and also we need people refusing searches to keep our Fourth Amendment rights -- rights against search & seizure -- alive. They were just seeing if they could get information about the drug dealer out of you -- the discovery of a needle was a side benefit. -- Be polite. If you don't cooperate by giving the police information, they may get insulting, abrasive and threatening to try to intimidate you into cooperating. That is a tactic that they learn. Don't be rude back; it will just invite escalation by the police, they will treat you worse and worse. -- Don't sign anything you don't have to. They got you to sign a confession in which you stated in writing that you had consented to the search. This means that the discovery of the needle won't be thrown out in court as the result of an unjustified search. You seem to have had the idea that your best bet was to cooperate completely with the police. This probably is the best way to ensure the police are pleasant to you, but it's not the best way to avoid a criminal charge. I wonder what the legal status of the needle exchange program is. You might be able to ask them for some advice, they have probably had other clients who were also arrested. Hopefully they won't be shut down now. Probably you shouldn't be posting the street the needle exchange program is on, on Usenet. ==================================================================== Subject: Busted With Syringe Update #1 - Arraignment Date: 21 Aug 1997 00:00:00 GMT From: Armand Newsgroups: alt.drugs.hard,alt.drugs,misc.legal,talk.politics.drugs Well, my Arraignment was a blast. The Public Defender is a bitch. But even worse, what I should have expected. Everything that the Fucking Pigs did was calculated to make me sign away my life. Everything that I told the cop who claimed he was there in training is in the police report. Everything that transpierd. The police acted as if the bust wasnt a very big deal, and as long as I cooperated there would be no trouble. Well. The standard Plea Bargain that the city offers is 30 days and Two Years probation. This would not include whatever I get for probation violation. And with what is in the police report, I am pretty much certain of conviction should I go to trial. Especially with this crappy PD defending me. At a minimum I will ask for a new defender. The Needle Exchange where I got my rigs has a deal with the Hollywood DA not to prosecute cases where they are picked up in the vicinity of the exchange during operating hours. I was picked up a block from their Downtown facilities, but not on an exchange day, and in any event, they have no outstanding arrangement with the City Attorney. I asked the Public Defender to explore this option, but I bet she will bungle it. I can't go to jail, though. I can't not pay rent for a month, I can't not work for a month. I can't tell my bosses that I will be in jail for a month. And it might be more than a month. I once swore that I would kill myself before I ever went back to jail, and the possibility of doing that has suddenly become much more real. I am still too afraid of an end to consiousness to do it. But I cannot imagine any other alternative. I dont know what to do. - -Armand ~~~